some simple ones...

[JohnnyB]

I got two PMs side by side condensers; the first is 12 year old Rheem crust says turned it on and nothing happened, everything inside worked nothing outside. I show up turn on t-stat and everything worked. So I immediately show cust to CYA. I tell him I got to start looking for stuff like bug in the contactor and such, well nothing, everything worked turn on turn off only thing is plug in diss is loose. I through gauges on and I'm watching head a little low and suck a little high, its cool out and only 68 inside, so I ramp up the head. block up the whole top and can't get head over 200psi more like 175. I try to pump it down, doesn't pump past 15psi; its got a long line set buried under a patio; when I shut it down it went up 5psi in a minute or so, its got bad valves right?? TD is 18 or so, not great. I ask my service manager he's like its fine leave it alone, so I did. The next unit, older same setup little shorter line set pumped down into vacume and held rock solid, after I pumped it back up again, it had leaked and customer didn't want it fixed "just get me through the summer" which I never guarantee and I say next time I got to fix it.

My question is I was going to sell the customer on killing the Rheem by showing him what it was supposed to do (pump down) YA or NA, and what's with my service manager, "its probably fine"?

Also, if you got like a 18+ year old GE that needed all new stuff, caps, fan blade, motor, contactor, but no compressor. 4 ton with matching furnace wouldn't you try to sell new system? 23 24 amps on a cold day to run rla 27 amps. In a nice house too.:confused:

[Breeze]

I may need to reread that stuff.... b 4 I really answer.

...ok some time has passed.... damm ants on my keyboard.

what was low pres., OD ambient, suck temp (there is something about that word it just doesnt look right in any sentence).

Just wondering...

without more data I can only say way over charged? But that is from here ... how many miles away from you... the high amps would make me think over charged but without the other stuff i am only netguessing.

[maverick]

Johnny, on the first unit, how many amps was it pulling? I would assume that with low head it wasn't pulling much. Sounds to me like a case of bad valves. I'll bet that if y'all have a hot summer he will be complaining. On the second unit, I also never guarantee getting through the summer. I would certainly point out the benefits of a new system because thats a lot of money to put in to an old condenser even if it is a GE. I had a GE in my house for about 12 years and I finally replaced it with a higher efficiency unit. Sold the GE to a guy for his rent house and the damn thing is still running good. That was 5 years ago.

[BaldLoonie]

Does sound like some leaking valves but if airflow inside is good, hard to beat a 18 temp drop!

[Breeze]

Maybe he overcharged it when he was a tech, thats why he doesnt want to say anything.

If it is overcharged enough the high press. can actually come down but the low will still go up. You are going to have a really cold suction temp and should even see most of compressor sweating, depending on outdoor temp and humidity.
That is a really good split for such a cold house. What was that ambient again outside?

The high amps could be a failing run cap as well.
Is this a H pump?

[JohnnyB]

Ya, the amps were low, RLA was like 15 or so and it was drawing like 9, low side was 30 32 deg and amb was like 70 d. Suction line wasn't very cold at all. When I covered up the fan to drive up the head couldn't get it above 175psi or so and the low side would shoot up to 75psi and the amps wouldn't go up much, at least I don't remember hearing it load up. I like to jam it up to 110 deg high side to simulate an 80 deg day when checking in low amb, but I always end up with low low super heat because its always really low load in house. High tons always start to freeze up on me. Air flow was good, What I'm thinking is it started out with and overcharge last summer and ended the summer with bad valves and has them this spring, its AC only up here unless its something other that air to air, I've only seen maybe two HP res systems up here that were air to air.

This guys going to be calling back for sure and I think he's some friend of my office manager, so I'm thinking I'm going to be the bad guy and she's going to get me some how. I hope I'm not the one going back or maybe I should, no matter what he in for some bad news. Next time should I just ignore what my service manager says and just wing it myself??

:confused:

[Breeze]

I can only digest a little right now. What was the low side pres. when it was running as normal, without blocking/killing fan?

When its cold out the system could freeze up pretty fast plus house was already cold, to me. You said 70° od ambient, that is not that cold but then your humidity could be lower than ours down here at 70° therefore it may not freeze up in your case.

What do they run the a/c at? Seems like 70 for indoor temp is cold... but that may just be me.

When you pumped it down, the extra 5 psig or so could have been all the liquid in the compressor boiling off bringing pres. up.

When valves leak back you can hear them some times after shut down, the temp rise on the suction line may increase.

The service manager thingy is another matter. Sometimes you just have to do what they say but keep good notes in your call book.

By the way I am sure everything I said you already know ... there just reminders.

[JohnnyB]

Items with > Originally posted by Breeze
>I can only digest a little right now. What was the low side pres. when it was running as normal, without blocking/killing fan?

It was like 30 32 deg, I always look at low side in the temp scale.

>When its cold out the system could freeze up pretty fast plus house was already cold, to me. You said 70° od ambient, that is not that cold but then your humidity could be lower than ours down here at 70° therefore it may not freeze up in your case.

Humidity is 50% RH so my WB probably like 65, this is all off top of head, without looking at a psychometric chart.

>What do they run the a/c at? Seems like 70 for indoor temp is cold... but that may just be me.

Everyone wants their ac to be checked now because one day its 65 70 the next its 80 90, and it can get real humid too.

>When you pumped it down, the extra 5 psig or so could have been all the liquid in the compressor boiling off bringing pres. up.

That's what my manager said, it did frost up the liquid line. and I waited about 10 minutes after the frost went away before shutting it off. It rose about 5psi in a minute.

>When valves leak back you can hear them some times after shut down, the temp rise on the suction line may increase.

I have seen this on rooftops where the fans quit and the head went up over 370 +; I would hear it discharge inside the shell, like an internal pressure relief and sometime they would work after the new fan sometimes not.

>The service manager thingy is another matter. Sometimes you just have to do what they say but keep good notes in your call book.

>By the way I am sure everything I said you already know ... there just reminders.

I look for reinforcement because I lack the work experience required for sound judgement, or at least the experience of working with others to know what I know or dont know......ya know......I dont know.

[Breeze]

I am just glad we have a place to talk about these things. I never had that at any place I worked and its worse when you do this stuff by yourself.

[diceman]

If you are absolutely sure you are shutting off the liquid condenser valve all the way and it won't pull down into a good vacuum, and you RLA amps are low, your valves are going bad and compressor needs changed.