Best Upgrade choices for new system? Pls help!!!

[amheck]

Hi group,
We are building a new house and the builder has a contract with 1 company. They are providing a Bryant 661 system, 5 ton/10 seer unit for 2700 sq feet downstairs, and 1.5 ton/10 seer for the 400 sq foot bonus room upstairs.

I would like to do something (an upgrade) for the downstairs because we live in Florida and like to keep the bedroom cool at night, and I'm worried about cooling 2700 feet just for the bedroom.

Here's some of the upgrades I can do for the downstairs unit:

1. Model 663 12.0 Seer $895

2. Model 663 13.5 seer with variable speed handler, Smart Heat, and Thermidstat $2175

3. Variable Speed air handler only $1419

4. 2 zone Bryant Damper System $2900

Which of these do you think would be the best bang for the buck?

Thanks! Aaron

[Maddog]

If you want to just cool the bedroom at night, then a zone system would accomplish that.

You might also check about putting in 2 units for the main floor instead of only one. Kinda the same principal as putting in a zone system, but more expensive. Without seeing a layout of the home, kinda difficult to advise you.

I REALLY like variable speed blower systems-they greatly increase your comfort level.

Personally, Bryant's not my favorite, but its better than a lot of stuff we see ending up on new construction.

[diceman]

Someone asked a serious question in here. What do we do guys?:bj

[Breeze]

I would go with zoned, as much as you can. Keep the number of complete systems down to a min. But then you may have to have more than one if duct work can't reach from one central spot.
If you have to have 2 systems why not zone main areas, including bonus room then run smaller system for master suite.

[Maddog]

Good idea, Breeze!

[Breeze]

I was agreeing with you ... guess I missed your post.

I am in process of dampering our house with 2 zones, then going to change the ducts out but this house is a nightmare to get around in the attics.

I really like the hottap (heats hot water in summer) but you really need to plan for stuff like that. At the very least have 3/8 to 1/2 copper (2 lines) run near hotwater heater and out to condenser, then maybe add the Hottap device later.

[amheck]

I called the company and found out that they use Troll-A-Temp systems for the zoning. Believe me, I know the zoning sounds like the best idea, but I have just read that there are so many problems.

I know you guys don't like to comment on price, but I'll throw it out and see if anyone bites. Does the $2800 price for zoning seem high, keeping in mind that the dampers, etc, will all go in at the same time as the base system. i.e. this won't be a complete re-do of an existing system, which I can understand makes it more difficult.

I'm also considering the mini-splits. They seem cool, but if the zoning were perfect, I think that's the way to go.

I haven't seen to many suggestions anywhere for the upgraded seers. Why is that? Does the additional cost usually not justify it? I was really leaning towards upgrade option #2 below, but that doesn't seem to be too popular among the people on these boards. Just curious as to why.

Thanks for all of the suggestions, guys.

Aaron

[JAMES 3528-old]

The additional cost also includes that extra five year warranty that you pay for.

[Breeze]

Troll-a-temp use to be a real pain (it may still be). I would think they have improved their system since it was such a bad design.
Have them show you the dampers or ask if it uses springs (you don't want that type).
If you are zoning past 2 then the cost really goes ups, the controller gets more complicated and of course you will need a tstat for each zone.

As for cost, again depends on how many zones. If you have 2 units then you have 2 of everything that can break in future so reducing the number of complete systems may reduce future repair work. If you can get a varible speed system and zone it you may only need one system. Better yet, if you could have a Trane 2 speed compressor, XL1800 vs. furnace and the zoned system, now that would be one really great system for a humid area like Florida. IMO of course.

[amheck]

Brezze,

Thanks for the comments. Troll-a-Temp is the only solution they use for zoning, so its either that, or nuthin'.

And unfortunetely, Bryant is the only system I can get. Believe me, I'd be all over the Trane system if I could. I just don't have that option.

The 2 units are standard for this house. One upstairs and 1 downstairs. The downstairs unit would be the only unit I wanna zone. So I'd end up with 2 seperate systems, 1 of those being zoned.

You think it still makes sense to upgrade the seer, get the variable speed unit, and thermidistat, along with the dual zone? For a total upgrade price of around $5000 over the cost of the base system?

Aaron

[Breeze]

Aaron,

I am unsure that zoning is going to work unless you have a really large master suite. Or could some how zone the upstairs with master. My main point is having a smaller unit take care of mast. bed and for rest of 1st floor use the 5 ton (they would need to do heat load again)

It sounds like you will be paying too much for the zone system and it may not even work in your case. Kind of hard to say with out seeing floor plan.

There is a website that has a energy calculator on it ... its here http://alltemp-hvac.com/calc/seercalc.html I have only tried it one time and it didn't work for me, maybe its working now.
You enter some data and get an idea how much you will save based on the seer you select.

[Pegleg Smith]

If this is your house, you should be able to get whatever you want, not what some contractor wants to sell you. Be firm and insist on the upgraded furnaces and higher seer Trane equipment. Also zone it with components from California Economizer or similar, and insist these be installed in accessable places.
You will pay more for this system but it will be worth it in the long run. If the price is included in the selling price of your home you will never notice the extra money but you will notice your comfort level is better than your neighbors.
I can imagine your general contractor is using that one company because they are the least expensive for him to use. Lowest bid gets the job! That a/c company probably buys large quantities of Bryant, so they get a price break.
As long as the house is being built, you can demand the a/c system be a Trane and that it is properly installed, with zoning and whatever else you want. Hell, you could probably get James to travel to Florida and do your work. How close to Georgia are you? Besides, he needs to make some money. I bet he'll work cheap!:D

[Breeze]

I also agree with Pegleg, you should be able to get what you want unless a contract was already signed but even then you do have options. You may be in that house for 7 or more years, plenty of time for upgrades to pay for themselves.

Don't forget a good media filter: aprilaire, spacegard or honeywell
You should also get a 10 year parts and labor warranty with a Trane unit, they are free with the XL1800.

[amheck]

Here's a page I just put up with the floorplan.

http://home.tampabay.rr.com/reef/carrington.html

Man, if I could only explain the situation. This builder is SO strict. They really will not allow any changes other than what they have already approved. We already had to use the law to get the lot that we put a down=payment on back from them, so they are probably pretty pissed and not going to budge.

I have a call and email into the AC company asking if I can use a different brand, but I can already tell you what the answer will be.

I'll let you guys know what they say.

[Pegleg Smith]

but most builders would be doing back flips trying to get you to approve the changes so they could make more money on the job. This is a tract house isn't it? Not a lot of profit per house.
You have to ask yourself whose money is paying for this house in the long run, your's or the builders'.
If the builder is so strict about the job I would be wondering if perhaps he wasn't qualified as a builder. Changes make the incompetent ones nervous. Even the national builders get incompetent job supervisors.
The type of toilets, sinks, faucets, and water heaters are all negotiable. There's even an optional bathroom upstairs.(Go for it) The air system should be upgradable, too.
In the end it is YOUR money and you must live with this house. If you want certain things done, demand they be done by this guy, or another if he refuses. The bank will probably back you on the upgrades because that makes the house more attractive to future buyers :yum who will want to snap it up when it is resold.

[BaldLoonie]

Still think a mini-split or GE Zoneline 5500 for the master bedroom would work out well. Having a 5 ton fire up for 1 room is not efficient and shortens the life of the unit. The other thought is put a 1 ton split with air handler in the attic for the bedroom and the bath area. If the AHU sat above the bathroom, it wouldn't be heard lying in bed :sleep and would be able to handle the ceiling of the bedroom.

[Maddog]

Where you been, brother Loonie? You post here less than me these days.

[beb]

Ask that Bryant Dealer about the Bryant Zone perfect Plus . It a modulating zoning system that is very for giving on zone size.